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 I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)

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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySat Mar 09, 2013 4:33 pm

I thought I'll open this treat although it will take a further while until there will be the sound of a live diesel engine swinging in the air. But I think it's a good place for questions and answers. And I guess there will be a lot questions. Hopefully answers too Wink.

I just tell and show you what I got so far.

The loco will be a B'B' loosely based on a Plymouth CR-8XT.
The scale is 1/13.3. The gauge is 45mm.
LxWxH will be 60cm x 14cm x 20cm (probably there will be some minor changes if necessary)
The wheelbase is 70mm. Wheel dia is almost 45mm.

This will be a diesel mechanical loco so no electric motor is planed in.
The engine is a Force 21 (3,46cm³). The main gear box is a 3 speed one originally built for 1:10 truck models. The clutch is from a 1:16 tank model (I believe Tamiya Leopard or Gepard old versions)
Behind the 3 spd gear box there will be the reverse gearbox and the divider gearbox.

All 4 axles will be powered. The 2 inner ones will be driven by a shaft while the outer ones will get it's drive by a chain.

Here are some pics of the drawings I did and the parts so far (sorry for the quality). The front drawing has already changed. The bogie is narrower now.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Seiteklein

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Frontklein

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Bogieklein

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Rahmenklein

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Motor

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Kupplungklein

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) 3gangklein1

Questions and thoughts are welcome.

_________________
Lorenz
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Mar 10, 2013 11:05 am

A diesel mechanical.....

I shall follow this with obvious interest. geek

It's strange as I was only talking to someone recently about using a tank mechanism.

The tank clutch and gearbox from Tamiya (I don't know of any other make) are very old. They stopped making those in the 1980s I believe.
But what a great piece of quality engineering. I would like one of those please! Rolling Eyes

I'm curious to see how you are going to initially mate up the glow plug engine to the transmission. Are you going to use a centrifugal clutch first or some other heavy duty coupling?


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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Mar 10, 2013 1:21 pm

Tried to do some better shots and used SketchUp this time.
Started
with the bogie. I realized that there is much more need of thinking.
Anyone got an idea how to house the bevel gear so that it's able to move
with the axle while suspending? With the trucks where I'm from it's
easier.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_02Mar101358

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_01Mar101357

Hello Carl,

The world is small as a village Wink.
Yes I think those clutches are really good. I'll pm you.

I didn't plan to use a centrifugal clutch because I saw that Detritus is running on a bit more than idling revs. I don't think that i would need higher revs. But then I read your postings about removing the spring so that the shoes will engage imidiatly after starting (I also saw the mess with the universal joints. One of them was my choise too). Maybe that could be an option and solve some problems by creating others Rolling Eyes. What do you think?

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Lorenz
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Mar 10, 2013 2:44 pm

I assume that you are going to use cardan shafts and universal joints but they should be fine at this part of the drive train. It was only when directly connected to the engine that they failed miserably because of the high rpm and torque.

The speed at which the cardan shafts will rotate after the gearbox will be much less than say a boat propeller and people use proprietary universal joints (Graupner):

Here's one supplier in the uk: Cornwall Model Boats
But they are easily available in Germany.

Personally I think the bevel gears would need to be kept in perfect alignment without moving and a short stub shaft off the bevel gaer connected to a (possibly double) universal joint and then to a cardan shaft and the gear box... ...maybe!
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Mar 10, 2013 3:19 pm

When my calculations are correct it'll have a ratio of 70.4:1 on the
axles that means idle speed of the engine is 6500rpm 0,78 Km/h in the
1st gear (perfect shunting speed Wink) and a ratio of 12,48:1 and about
4.4 Km/h in the 3rd gear (almost a race car Wink.

I thought about
the bone shaped shafts from the 1:10 and 1:8 nitro cars for transmitting
the power from the divider to the bogies.
Yes I know that the bevel
gears have to be in perfect alignment so I need a way to house it so
it'll be able to make the movements that the axle will do.

On my logger the bevel gears are in the axle housings and these are suspended by the springs within the wheels. But on this loco the suspention is outsides the wheels.

_________________
Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Mar 10, 2013 7:51 pm

The loco i crudly finished, but only in SketchUp. Just to show you how it should look like.

The engine isn't mine. It was a downloadable model that I scaled that it almost fits the dims of my engine.
The block in the center is the main gear box.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_06Mar102044

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_03Mar102041

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_04Mar102042

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_05Mar102042

_________________
Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyWed Mar 13, 2013 4:56 pm

Had an idea for the axle gear box and it's guidence. I was thinking about how it's on my logger and I came to this. I also moved the chain drive on the outer side of the wheels.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_03Mar131747

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_01Mar131641

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_02Mar131642

_________________
Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Mar 18, 2013 9:23 am

Just a little update on the sketch.

I raised the cab a bit, made some headlights and handrails.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) ScreenHunter_01Mar181020

_________________
Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyTue Apr 02, 2013 5:36 pm

Dan Snow said the worst on the victorian trains were there breaks. We aren't at victorian times anymore but good breaks are still important. I thought for a while what to use and I found this in my stock.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Bremsbackenklein

They are made for 1/12 trucks and I think a good choice. I plan to install them on the drive shafts to the 2nd and 3th axle. We'll see if it works.

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyTue Feb 04, 2014 7:18 pm

I found some time to think about the bogies and to rework it. I canceld the chain drive and built in 2 bevel gear boxes. I also draw a new guiding system for the axles.
But still no physical progress Wink

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Plymouth

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Physical progress   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Jul 27, 2014 8:21 pm

I managed to get started. I found some time to work on the main frame. But I guess it'll take some time again for another progress.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0652

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0653

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Lorenz
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dewintondave

dewintondave

Location : New Zealand

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyWed Jul 30, 2014 9:26 am

Congratulations on your project Lorenz!  Someone posted a comment on my gearbox video "wouldn't it be more sensible to use an IC car gearbox".  Smile  

Best of luck with your project,
Dave.
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https://www.youtube.com/user/dewintondave
Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyWed Jul 30, 2014 8:23 pm

Many thx Dave Smile. I guess your loco would be a true racer on the tracks than Wink.

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Lorenz
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 7:31 pm

Lorenz,

That's a decent looking chassis and you already have an engine ready to fit a clutch to. Do you still want me to look at assembling a generator set for you?
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 8:15 pm

Many thx Carl.
Yes I still want you to do this for me. I would like to build a diesel electric loco too. It's easier for me to use proofed parts than to reinvent the wheel.

_________________
Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyTue Aug 26, 2014 7:38 pm

A little bit more slow progress.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0666

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0667

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptySun Aug 31, 2014 6:41 pm

Some more minor progress. I started to work on the bogies. Drilled, sawed and filed the guides for the axle bearings.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0668

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0671

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Lorenz
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Sep 01, 2014 7:25 pm

Still sorting out bits and pieces Lorenz. I need to source a decent, sensibly priced caburettor and I'll  be there.

A bit behind at the moment because of work again and new responsibility!
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Sep 01, 2014 7:54 pm

No problem Carl and thank you Smile.

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyMon Jan 12, 2015 10:25 pm

I found some time to get back to the Plymouth and continue work on the 1st bogie. I made the outher frame and still be working on the wheel cages.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0812

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0813

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0818

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0819

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyTue Jan 13, 2015 4:36 pm

A bit more bogie.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0825

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0823

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0822

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0821

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyWed Jan 14, 2015 1:03 pm

The latest progress.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0826

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0828

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0829

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Lorenz
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyThu Jan 15, 2015 4:05 pm

Now with working, independent equalizer bars.

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0831

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0832
I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) IMAG0833

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Lorenz
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Saint-Oblas

Saint-Oblas

Location : Lyon, France

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyThu Jan 15, 2015 5:30 pm

C'est très sophistiqué: tu vas avoir une tenue de voie sensationnelle!  N'ayant pas d'outillage, j'ai dû m’accommoder de bogies standards (un dernier lot d'Aristocraft). Mais ma loco ne devrait pas aller vite (dans la réalité son modèle n'allait qu'à 45 km/h sur les voies du Congo) donc cela devrait passer.

Excuse me I realize that I have written in french!

I was just writing that it was a very fancy solution and that the track holding should be fantastic. As far as I am concerned, having no machine tools, I had to keep with standard commercial solutions: in that case a very last set of Aristocraft trucks). But as my loc, as well as the original one on the Congo line, will go very slowly, it should work out.

Good luck in your proceeding along!
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Tacbob



Location : Harz, Germany

I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) Empty
PostSubject: Re: I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel)   I got a plan (or my 1st live diesel) EmptyThu Jan 15, 2015 5:45 pm

Hello Saint-Oblas Vsorry, I don't know your name),
Many thanks. Yes, I think you're right and track going will be very good.. I fess it would be resizable in wood too. Easier to work with. And less machines needed.

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Lorenz
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