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 Anton's Live Diesel

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KleineDicke




Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyTue Dec 07, 2010 10:37 pm

Carl:
The Regner catalog description says you can specify 32mm if that's what you need. The 72006 kit is to add connecting rods to the wheels.

Page 92 has the power block - part number 72001 - which is 69.90 euros.
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyTue Dec 07, 2010 11:48 pm

Im looking at sparkewoods class 25 diesel. I like the way its a simple construction out of bolsa.

I Ive been bathering some ply wood that wood work a treat on a simular model but in diesel electric of course. Im in the process of getting the dimensions from him...take a look at the bogies on his diesel...where do you think i could get something like those from?
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyWed Dec 08, 2010 6:55 am

KleineDicke wrote:
Carl:
The Regner catalog description says you can specify 32mm if that's what you need. The 72006 kit is to add connecting rods to the wheels.

Page 92 has the power block - part number 72001 - which is 69.90 euros.

Thanks Bill, I knew my German wasn't up to much.

Still 69.90euros for a quality motor block with good profile wheels. You could pay that for Aristocraft.



Anton, those bogies are 45mm gauge on Troys's diesel. In effect his diesel is gauge 1.
But if you want advice on making wooden bodies he is the man to ask. See his trams.


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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyWed Dec 08, 2010 8:19 am

Carl i have found these....

http://www.glendalejunction.co.uk/IPHomeBuild.html

and........
http://www.ipengineering.co.uk/page138.html

they dont look sturdy as they are from wood? or is that me being stupid?

and i know his loco was 45mm i was going to make something with a similar size but to run on 32mm..not to bothered about scale.....but yes i see...those bogies would not work...my bad.....but check out those links above...what do you think?..they are not to expensive...well £50 for a pair of powered bogies or £35 for one powered and one unpowered....
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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyWed Dec 08, 2010 9:11 am

I've used IP engineering motors and wheels and the quality is okay...but just okay.

The motors are cheap and they use plastic gears and worms. The gearbox is made of whitemetal.

They serve okay on lightweight railcars and small locos but to be honest I am not sure about a larger heavyweight diesel loco.

Have you thought about making your own. If you have a pillar drill it would be quite straightword. You could make them out of brass. It's just a matter of drilling holes in the right places!
Buy some motors and gears of ebay, use IP wheels and bearings.... eh voila.

BTW I braved the snow and posted your chassis this morning.

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David Grantham



Location : Midlands, England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyWed Dec 08, 2010 9:36 pm

Anton

I have just contacted Essel because of your response and also because I will also want some for myself.

Here is the reply received today :-

"""
Hello David, the bogies supplied to Locomotion are our part no.009A price £59.50 each. Locomotion use 15:1 gearing, but 30:1 is an alternative, if you prefer.
"""

Hope this helps,
David
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyWed Dec 08, 2010 10:43 pm

Hi carl..thank you very much for posting the chassis..much appreciated Smile and yes i thought they looked a bit crappy.....well thank you for letting me know anyway and im starting to see that you cant really get good bogies for less then bout £50 each Sad......

And I do have access to a pillar drill but would be useless at making them...

David....Thank you very much for letting me know this....im guessing you are adding these to your live diesel? if you do..would you consider selling the old ones you have? just a thought Smile

cheers guys
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David Grantham



Location : Midlands, England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyThu Dec 09, 2010 3:07 pm

Anton,

the pair of old Essel bogies I am using for testing my live diesel are of little use as they will not run reliably on anything but dead horizontal track. I guess, though I need to check, that they would be OK individually, like your prototype. I did find a prototype on a UK quarry line that was a largish Fowler centre cab 2-4-0 which would be suitable ie one Essel bogie plus an unpowered axle.

When I have replaced the old Essel bogies with new ones I would be happy to give you one of the old ones if you can use it and I can use the other for the above 2-4-0. This could take a couple of months.

David
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyThu Dec 09, 2010 7:42 pm

HI david...yes get what your saying about the worm drive problem..hmm that would be difficult on my layout.

I still wouldnt mind trying...could they not be converted to beavel?

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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySat Dec 11, 2010 7:37 pm

antonr91 wrote:
was that the correct carb?


It came today and sadly no it wasn't the right fitting. The carb they sent me was as described for .15/.18/.21 engine and has a 10mm dia fitting.

The engine I need it for is a .12 with an 8.5 mm fitting. I can't really ream out the engine carb housing, that would be butchery!

Still nevermind it was cheap and will be useful as a spare for other engines.

So I still need a carb 8.5mm or smaller fitting.... scratch
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySat Dec 11, 2010 8:48 pm

hmmmmm....well that has surprised me as 12 and 15 are usually the same size....my engine came today and i have taken into consideration what you said about to hymek looking odd...i have now halfed the length and it looks alot better...I need to shape both front and back which will be the hard part....

Ill keep a look out....
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyFri Dec 17, 2010 3:01 pm

Ok well here is the bit that I am completely stuck with...circuit boards...

I here is a picture of the old fashioned board I have as i thought it would be simple to use...but i cant figure out how to use it.. its out of the old triang Hymek I have...the idea being that i want to attach the generator motor power to this board which I can then turn the handle and determine whether the loco goes forward, backward slow and fast all on this board....as it worked likes that on the Hymek.

Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone48 Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone49Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone50

Would any body be able to help with this one or creating a new one or both Very Happy

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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyFri Dec 17, 2010 6:48 pm

We can help you Anton..... Smile

If anyone one has direct experience of thes boards that maybe the first.
I have never seen one in the flesh.

I guess from the pictures it is just a copper clad paxolin board with a wiper that makes contact with a resistance to give primitive speed adjustment and reversing.

A better way for reversing would be DPDT (double pole double throw) switch with a centre off.
These are available from Maplins or sometimes from car accessory shops.

To get the speed would mean another control and again a simple Hi/lo speed with maybe diodes to affect the change of voltage.

Someone also once posted a rotary selected diode controller......Maybe Bill?




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dtsteam

dtsteam

Location : Preston, England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyFri Dec 17, 2010 7:38 pm

I think the Hymek board dosen't make sense because bits are missing. As I recollect there was an arm on either side of the board - one for on and off (the existing one) & one for forward & reverse (the missing one). There was no 'centre off' on the reversing switch, as you could clip a pillar to the track which would nudge the arm over and cause the train to reverse.

It may have been me that posted the diode/wafer switch controller. I have an idea for a simple variant with 5 positions : Fast fwd - slow fwd - off - slow rev - fast rev
which you may be able to drive from a servo. If its of any interest I'll sketch it out over the weekend.
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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyFri Dec 17, 2010 9:27 pm

Sorry Dave I think it was you now...

It's just that Bill too often comes up with good things like that.

I would certainly be interested in seeing the diode/wafer switch controller.
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySat Dec 18, 2010 9:00 am

Hi Dave...I would love it if you could do that for me but please make it very simple and easy to follow as I am not the best with circuits etc. In answer to your statement you are very correct about that board missing another lever...I don't no where I put it when it was removed. Silly me Very Happy I'm looking forward to seeing this board as it would really make running the loco easier.
Regards
Anton


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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyMon Dec 20, 2010 12:20 pm

Well its my birthday today and I now have a bit more money to spend on the little parts that i need. I am still eagerly awaiting Daves diagram for the circuit board and i hope to start buying things for my second loco.....

Carl....i have actually found a suitable motor (i hope) for the generator. It is a marine 550 motor and i am actually thinking of swapping the 850 motor to the hymek and using this 550 for the shunter as the 850 is on the large side, especially as it is only powering one motor unlike the hymek which will be powering 2 motors on 2 bogies.

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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyMon Dec 20, 2010 7:04 pm

I've got several 550 type motors in a collecting box but I find that none are powerful enough to start a glo plug engine directly.

What is the make and specification of the one you are using and do you intend to use it as a starter?.

550 motors come in various configurations and one I have is rated at 6 volts and another at 18 volts which came out of a cordless drill for 10 euros!
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyThu Dec 23, 2010 11:20 am

I do not know anything about the motor tbh Carl... actually the photos i emailed you at the start of the project, showing 4/5 motors that i wanted to use a generators before i bought the 850.....it is the 550 marine motor on the black plastic mount....

I am also now working in the vaccume formed body/shell. I am going to be heat testing it in the next few days to see if it will withstand the heat which think will work as funereally enough the force 15 revs relatively high without making to much heat Very Happy. I will not be making any custom exhaust system, for the shunter, i will do all that fancy work when it come to the Hymek, especially as the shunter has hardly any room left to work with. The only thing i have done is swapped the exhausts over, as the GX12 came with a suitable exhaust for the force 15 and the GX now has the ebay manifold which i love and looks rather cool and i will be adding a custom muffler to the GX a swell.
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptyFri Dec 24, 2010 1:07 pm

I have now added photos of the body on the loco - not neat or anything but it will do...take a look Very Happy
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 02, 2011 4:19 pm

Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone51 Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone52 Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone53
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 02, 2011 4:22 pm

I have also found this site: http://www.g-scale-society.co.uk/locomotives.htm

There is a guy on there who has also built a live diesel model and has done a pretty good job - take a look.

http://www.buntbahn.de/modellbau/viewtopic.php?t=1388 - This is also a very interesting site for a complex live diesel set up in a rail car/van???
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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 02, 2011 5:15 pm

These two projects are quite well known and admired. The last is exquisite and superbly engineered. There is another German one somewhere if I can find the link.

The English guy never contacted me back a couple of years ago but it is an interesting exercise and very similar to what we are doing. He's using a very small engine and motor (smaller than a 550 type) and also a small Oldham-sliding disc type coupling.

It just shows how small you can get this down to and really proves that there is no need to build a hoofing great monster like mine. Neutral
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 02, 2011 5:24 pm

Yes that German one is absolutely amazing. I would love to have the time, patience and skill to be able to construct something like that Smile
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 09, 2011 7:35 pm

DISASTER!!! the crank shaft snapped today leaving the engine and motor unconnected. I guess the stress was just to much. Well I im not to sure how easy it would be to put a new one in...im sure its not amazingly hard but I dont have the time at the moment. It has made me think Shunt could have done with a smaller motor and generator....

[img]Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone19[/img]
[img]Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone20[/img]
[img]Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone21[/img]
[img]Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone22[/img]
[img]Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 Iphone23[/img]

Hopefully I will be able now use the 850 for the Hymek as it will be powering 2 12v motors instead of 1 and Shunt can have the smaller generator motor it only needs to power 1 12v motor.
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Carl Hibbs
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Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: Anton's Live Diesel   Anton's Live Diesel - Page 2 EmptySun Jan 09, 2011 8:21 pm

That's sad Anton... Crying or Very sad

From the pics though it looks as if just the shaft at the end is broken. Unless I'm mistaken this is normally only a spigot (for the clutch bellhousing) threaded on to the main (crankshaft) usually an M5 thread on smaller engines up about .18 and often M6 on larger.

You should just be able to unscrew (often tight) and replace that part quite easily or dispense with it altogether.
Also do you really need the flywheel as that may add unecessary forces?

I don't run with one.

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