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 I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge

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Paulus




I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyMon Jun 18, 2012 9:43 pm

I just noticed you found that same Ebay add... Embarassed

But I did find something else. It's an UK based online shop called Eclipsebikes. They sell 'Motor kits' that contain a 24 volt 650 motor. However the sets are expensive. They have a category for motors only that is to be updated and does not show any items.
But perhaps you can email them if they sell the 24 volt / 650 watt motors loose from the kit.

Here's an example of the kit with 24 volt / 650 watt:
http://eclipsebikes.com/chainwheel-watt-ebike-p-972.html

And the empty motor catagory: http://eclipsebikes.com/parts-accessories-motors-c-59_1.html

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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyTue Jun 19, 2012 6:02 am

Paul, now that looks like a very good motor. Now the only issue with this motor is that it is Brishless, and i know very little about these. Im not sure if you know about them?

I know that Carl has used a brushless in one of his smaller models. Are brushles DC or AC?

I like the sound of it though, and i will email to ask how much Smile thank you Paul
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Paulus

Paulus

Location : The Netherlands

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyTue Jun 19, 2012 3:29 pm

What I can remember is that some modellers prefer brushless motors over the ones with brushes because they have no wear and no friction from the brushes.
I believe those are DC.

_________________
Paul pirat
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyWed Jun 20, 2012 7:43 am

antonr91 wrote:
Now the only issue with this motor is that it is Brishless, and i know very little about these. Im not sure if you know about them?

I know that Carl has used a brushless in one of his smaller models. Are brushles DC or AC?


We did this about 18 months ago.

See:
http://www.cgtrains.com/t789p15-live-diesel-2
...and other diesel threads.

BLDC motors are BrushLess DC but they (model motors) are mostly 3 phase although there are 2 phase types that I have not dealt with.

A brushless motor could be DC or AC. You will need to check it.

If it's AC then you can convert (rectify) it but as said before be careful....peak voltages and and high currents.....
'study'
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyWed Jun 20, 2012 5:54 pm

Paul, again, thanks for that input Smile

Carl, i do remember you doing this with your diesels, but it looked to complex and i thought i would stay well away from it affraid

But i have good news, ive just purchased a 24v 1000 watt mobility scooter motor Very Happy so finally, something that should be very well suited, as its rated at 1hp

Now this is the tricky part: the motor shaft is not a normal one, as its a mobility scooter, its meant to run through a gearbox on the scooter, and therefore the shaft is very very short, and a starnge shape, two flat sides and two quarter circles on each end....take a look at the link below which shows a few examples...or it may even be a hexagonal...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/spare-part-MOTOR-freerider-mayfair-mobility-scooter-/170861899370?pt=UK_Health_Beauty_Mobility_Disability_Medical_ET&hash=item27c829ae6a#ht_500wt_1413

Now the issue is: how do i attach this to the shaft of the clutch...pictured below....

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0827[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0828[/img]

So any sergestions are very very welcome...
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2012 12:42 pm

Well the motor just came this morning, and its a lot bigger then a thought it would be, but its fits in the designated place, and therefore should work perfectly.

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0829[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0830[/img][img]

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0831[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0832[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0833[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0834[/img]

Now i have to work on the bracket or brackets that are going to hold the motor in place, and try and find a way of coupling the two shafts together. The round shaft in the middle of the plastic thing actually looks to be a very similar diameter to the shaft of the clutch, so that could make things easier...
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tram47

tram47

Location : Aquitaine (France)

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2012 1:44 pm

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 547623 VROUMM!!!!!
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyTue Jun 26, 2012 5:34 pm

After a cancelled day flying, and many broken tools, i have attempted to make the coupling between the suffolk engine and dc motor. Ive copied the way the smaller one was made on the diesel model, and this is what ive achieved, or should have achieved...:

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0835[/img]
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyTue Jun 26, 2012 5:40 pm

After a cancelled day flying, and many broken tools, i have attempted to make the coupling between the suffolk engine and dc motor. Ive copied the way the smaller one was made on the diesel model, and this is what ive achieved, or should have achieved...:

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0836[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0837[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0838[/img]

[img]I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Img_0839[/img]

Now this should have worked, but i had such trouble drilling the holes and making sure they were the right size and a tight fit, that i must have made a mystake along the way, as there is just to much movement on the engine, which means the holes arnt lines up correctly. NBow i did actually drill right the way through that piece of joining metal, which started life out as a COLD CHISSEL early today.

Now this has knocked me back a little, as i do not have the time or the patiance or the nowhow of how to get this coupling to work scratch

It took me about 5 hours to make it today, and it was a fail....looks good though
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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 8:09 pm

I admire your enthusiasm Anton but looking at these pictures causes me some concern over safety.
I would look at the mounting for that electric motor and fabricate something more substantial and secure.
You may want to investigate a heavy duty flexible coupling between engine and motor to absorb any misalignment and vibration.
I doesn't matter if this takes months or years to build but be safe.

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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 8:21 pm

Hi Carl

Yes i think you are correct in the safety region, as i had another engineer minded person who happens to be my boss come over today and look at it, and he just said having a 24v 1000 watt motor ticking over at 2500 rpm, which would be making 40 amps or more, could cause serious injury to myself, especially on the all metal chassis.

He also mentions that the motor should be properly fastened and not "bodge jobbed". Ill be the first to admit that i am always in a hurry to get it working and i compromise alot in being like that..i blame my age Wink

JUst another note on the coupling though, it actually doesnt move, or has very little movement, and is sufficiant enough, as long the the engine is held in place firmly...

Do you know where i could get such a coupling from Carl? This is where i really start needing the help.... Smile

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Carl Hibbs
Admin
Carl Hibbs

Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 5:36 am

For a coupling you can source on the internet. I wouldn't like to advise exactly what type.

There many companies selling engineering and electrical equipment such as RS components.

If your boss is an engineer then get him on board with the project and ask more of his advice.
If he sees you progressing as a result, that may benefit your work too.
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 7:35 am

Right well i just found this: http://www.ondrives.com/couplings.html

They seem very pricey but would solve alot of problems.

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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptyMon Jul 02, 2012 12:21 pm

Well ive just been talking to the technical department on ondrives.com and a very helpful guy talked me through all the elements i should take into consideration and we finally decided on a oldham coupling that has the safety factor on torque, rpm, and vertical and horizontal miss-alignment.

It cost me £40 which is far better then me messing around trying to make a perfect coupling.

Now this gives me time to fully work on engine mount and getting everything fully and safely fixed to the chassis.
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antonr91

antonr91

Location : south-east England

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PostSubject: Re: I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge   I want to build a Live Diesel for 3.5 or 5 inch gauge - Page 3 EmptySat Oct 06, 2012 8:24 am

Right, having just got back from Florida, i now want to start work on this loco again, as the longer i leave it, the less motivated i get to continue.

Now i am in the same position as last time, and taking on Carls advice, i really need to get a secure motor mount sorted. I have the oldham flexible coupling, which should now cater for small misalignments, so as long as i can get this motor fixed down correctly, i should be another stage further, and i could test the locos generating power.
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